Moving on from loss using Creativity with Linda Rivero

Wendy Green:

: 00:00:31

Hello and welcome to the Hey Boomer show.

Wendy Green:

: 00:00:35

The show for those of us who believe that we are never too old to set another goal or

Wendy Green:

: 00:00:41

dream a new dream.

Wendy Green:

: 00:00:42

My name is Wendy Green and I am your host for Hey, Boomer.

Wendy Green:

: 00:00:47

And today I'm coming to you live from Asheville, North Carolina.

Wendy Green:

: 00:00:51

I am here at my daughter's house.

Wendy Green:

: 00:00:54

And tonight, we are going to see the Carolina Youth Symphony, where her son will

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:00

be playing percussion.

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:01

So I am definitely looking forward to that.

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:06

With the Hey Boomer show.

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:07

I always want people to walk away from each episode feeling like they met someone whose

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:13

story they could relate to or someone who they feel inspired by or they have learned

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:21

something from.

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:22

And in today's episode, the inspiration and learnings will come from our conversation

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:28

about moving on from loss with Linda Rivero.

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:33

And as I was preparing for this episode, I was thinking about what I wanted to do to

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:38

frame the conversation.

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:40

And I found a short essay from writer Monique Minahan.

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:45

And she wrote this when she lost a partner, which is similar to what happened with Linda

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:52

and what led her into the work that she's doing today.

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:56

So Monique wrote.

Wendy Green:

: 00:01:59

"Grief taught me.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:01

Loss expands before it shrinks.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:05

The list of what I've lost is not just one line, but pages long.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:12

Sometimes because I didn't just lose a human being I loved.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:17

I lost the sound of their feet in the hallway.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:21

The water running as they brush their teeth.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:24

The sight of their face down the hall.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:27

The sound of their voice on the phone.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:30

The ability to reach out and touch them.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:35

Everyone's list is unique and endless.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:39

I try to honor the living by not turning away from their list of loss, by not telling

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:46

them what it should contain, by not comparing my list to theirs.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:52

This grief.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:54

She's like a mother to me.

Wendy Green:

: 00:02:56

She birthed me into an experience I never asked for and many times was not sure I would

Wendy Green:

: 00:03:03

survive. But together we make it through this life, stumbling and learning, mourning

Wendy Green:

: 00:03:13

and celebrating.

Wendy Green:

: 00:03:15

Each step, teaching us all we need to know about what it means to live, to love and to

Wendy Green:

: 00:03:23

lose." In this episode, we will talk about grief and loss, how it can be overwhelming

Wendy Green:

: 00:03:32

and feel debilitating at times.

Wendy Green:

: 00:03:35

And we'll talk about moving on from these debilitating feelings to that place where we

Wendy Green:

: 00:03:41

can feel alive again.

Wendy Green:

: 00:03:43

Be open to love again and find things to celebrate again.

Wendy Green:

: 00:03:50

Linda Rivero is a counselor and a coach and the founder of 55AndBolder.co , and she will

Wendy Green:

: 00:03:59

help us understand more about this process.

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:01

And I'm going to introduce you to her in just a few minutes.

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:05

But before I do, I want to mention our sponsor, Road Scholar.

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:11

Road Scholar is the not for profit leader in educational travel for boomers and beyond.

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:19

They have trips to all 50 states and over 100 countries.

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:24

You know, I love traveling with Road Scholar and in fact, this summer I have two trips

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:29

planned. In June, I'm going to Costa Rica.

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:33

And I think some of you are joining me on that trip.

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:36

And then in July, I am taking my youngest grandson on a Windjammer cruise off the coast

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:41

of Maine with Road Scholar.

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:43

We're very much looking forward to that.

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:46

So I promise that you will love your experience of traveling with Road Scholar.

Wendy Green:

: 00:04:52

Go to their website at RoadScholar.Org/HeyBoomer, to check out all

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:01

of their amazing educational adventures.

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:07

And the Hey Boomer podcast is brought to you entirely free.

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:12

It is a labor of love and it really does take a lot of time and effort to bring you

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:18

high quality shows every week.

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:21

So I have to ask two favors to ask of you.

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:27

First. I would like you to share this episode with friends or family, people that

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:34

you know who would benefit from hearing us talk about moving on from loss or that would

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:40

benefit from any of the shows that we do on Hey, Boomer.

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:45

If you're listening live, you can tag them in the comments and that will let them know

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:50

that you think they should listen or watch the rerun.

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:53

And if you are listening to it on the podcast, please go ahead and like the show

Wendy Green:

: 00:05:58

first and then share it with your friends.

Wendy Green:

: 00:06:03

And if you want to support the work I'm doing, please go to

Wendy Green:

: 00:06:09

BuyMeaCoffee.com/HeyBoomer0413.

Wendy Green:

: 00:06:35

and contribute any amount that you feel comfortable with.

Wendy Green:

: 00:06:39

I appreciate you and I will recognize you on the show.

Wendy Green:

: 00:06:42

I'll recognize you in the newsletter for your contributions unless you tell me you

Wendy Green:

: 00:06:46

want to remain anonymous.

Wendy Green:

: 00:06:49

So thank you so much for that.

Wendy Green:

: 00:06:53

And now let me tell you a little bit about Linda.

Wendy Green:

: 00:06:56

She is the founder of 55AndBolder, a company dedicated to inspiring and guiding women 55

Wendy Green:

: 00:07:05

and beyond who have suffered a deep loss to reignite the zest for living we all had in

Wendy Green:

: 00:07:13

our youth. Through her coaching and her SOAR course s o a r soar course, Linda

Wendy Green:

: 00:07:21

lovingly guides her clients to discover and embrace the passionate, purpose driven

Wendy Green:

: 00:07:26

direction that gives their lives renewed meaning and leaves them feeling fulfilled,

Wendy Green:

: 00:07:32

thrilled and fabulous.

Wendy Green:

: 00:07:35

She believes that creativity and creative pursuits are keys to recapturing happiness.

Wendy Green:

: 00:07:44

A serial entrepreneur.

Wendy Green:

: 00:07:45

Linda has had a colorful career path.

Wendy Green:

: 00:07:49

She has been a counselor and an educator of teens and adults, an official circus

Wendy Green:

: 00:07:55

photographer and a university professor of Italian and Spanish.

Wendy Green:

: 00:08:01

As a travel planner, Linda was thrilled to receive national press recognition for her

Wendy Green:

: 00:08:07

hundreds of individualized creative tours of the Italian countryside.

Wendy Green:

: 00:08:13

She was also proud to be honored at the embassy of Cameroon for her inspiring work

Wendy Green:

: 00:08:19

bringing American women to Senegal, West Africa, to work with local Senegalese women

Wendy Green:

: 00:08:26

on urgently needed projects.

Wendy Green:

: 00:08:30

And during the past nine years, Linda has fulfilled a lifelong dream, dedicating her

Wendy Green:

: 00:08:36

personal time to developing her singing and studying vocal improvisation with master

Wendy Green:

: 00:08:43

improvisers Bobby McFerrin and Rhiannon.

Wendy Green:

: 00:08:48

So with that, let me introduce you to Linda.

Wendy Green:

: 00:08:52

Hi, Linda.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:08:54

Hi, Wendy.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:08:55

I'm so happy to be here.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:08:57

Thank you.

Wendy Green:

: 00:08:58

Yes. And I have enjoyed our conversation so far.

Wendy Green:

: 00:09:01

So I'm excited to bring you to to the audience.

Wendy Green:

: 00:09:06

So if you would, give us a little background.

Wendy Green:

: 00:09:09

What what happened that has so devastated you and now reinvigorated you to start this

Wendy Green:

: 00:09:17

new business?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:09:18

Right. A great lead in to that answer is referencing the quote that you opened your

Linda Rivero:

: 00:09:26

show with, particularly the beginning.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:09:29

I remember my husband died ten years ago.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:09:34

And at the time that he died, we had been close for 53 years because we were were kids,

Linda Rivero:

: 00:09:40

young kids together.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:09:42

So that's a lot of years to lose, to lose a relationship.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:09:48

And what she was saying at the beginning of her quote was that it's not just the loss of

Linda Rivero:

: 00:09:54

your partner. I remember after a few months and I was like a deer in headlights.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:09:59

I was just not I couldn't do anything except eat and watch movies, which was not not

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:07

terribly healthy. But it got me through.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:09

Right. But I remember realizing one day, it's not just that I lost my husband, my

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:15

partner. You lose everything.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:17

You lose everything. I mean, everything is completely upside down.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:21

And I distinctly remember telling a close girlfriend and I remember writing it in a

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:27

journal. I felt like a dinghy alone in the dead of night in the midst of a black ocean.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:35

That that's exactly how it felt.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:38

So it's.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:39

It's so much more than, like, losing.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:43

Losing. Losing the guy.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:45

Yeah. It yeah.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:46

It reverberates in ways that that I never expected and I don't think anybody expects

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:53

that. And I really don't think there's frankly personally I don't think there's any

Linda Rivero:

: 00:10:57

way to prepare for for that kind of loss except the experience.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:11:02

Yeah. You just don't know until you're in it.

Wendy Green:

: 00:11:05

And so you you were struggling in that.

Wendy Green:

: 00:11:09

And and something inspired you to say, I need to help other people.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:11:14

Right. Well, the first thing I had to do was help myself because I was nowhere.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:11:19

And after months and months went by, I remember I realized one day that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:11:29

Um. Oh, my God. Life really is finite.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:11:33

Of course, we all know this, but I never knew it until I really knew it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:11:39

You know, when that last moment comes, you're out of time.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:11:42

The sand has run dry.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:11:44

That's it. No more opportunities.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:11:46

And I remember asking myself, what is it that I would would be distraught, dying

Linda Rivero:

: 00:11:55

without having tried?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:11:57

What do I need to do before I have no more time?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:01

And immediately I knew the answer.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:03

And for me, it was it was music.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:05

And I have a lot of music in my in my personal background, but singing in

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:09

particular. And that's when I just said, okay, I'm going to do this.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:15

And I was in my 60 seconds.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:17

I mean, it's not so easy getting your voice back in your 60s, boy, because things change.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:25

But I found a wonderful turned out to be perfect for me vocal coach.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:31

And she she got me back and I worked hard at it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:35

And then I became just enchanted with, with, with free style improvisation as opposed to,

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:41

like, jazz improvisation, which people are more familiar with Ella Fitzgerald and who's,

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:47

you know, the top of the top of skill.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:49

Yeah. But not it's not that it's more creating music on the spot.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:54

Like I didn't know where to start.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:12:56

And the master of that, of course, is Bobby McFerrin.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:00

For those who are familiar with it and a colleague of his, a singer he's been working

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:04

with for like 45 years.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:06

Her name is Rhiannon, not the young Rhiannon.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:08

It's a different man.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:10

And I started working with I started working with her, going to workshops and traveling

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:15

all over the place, following her around, and I finally auditioned for and got into her

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:20

what she calls her master class.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:22

That went on for a year.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:23

And so I really got into it seriously and loved it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:27

And now, even now I'm still doing groups of their small groups.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:32

But I'm I keep the skill going.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:35

Yeah. You know, somewhat.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:37

So it's good.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:38

And it just brought me back to life.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:41

Yeah. And that and then after that, I started as I was doing that, I started

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:45

thinking, you know. It's there's when I look back, there was essentially a system.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:52

I didn't know it, but.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:54

I could see a system in this, you know?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:13:56

And that's when I started thinking, well, why don't I help other people?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:14:00

Because it can be really, really tricky finding your way through when you feel you're

Linda Rivero:

: 00:14:08

ready to find your way through.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:14:10

Which is different from being in the thick of grief.

Wendy Green:

: 00:14:13

Right. And so it sounds like the first thing that helped you start to find your way back

Wendy Green:

: 00:14:19

or through I think through is a better word than think.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:14:22

Through is a better word.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:14:23

Yeah.

Wendy Green:

: 00:14:24

So was was asking yourself that question.

Wendy Green:

: 00:14:28

What would I what would I miss if I died now?

Wendy Green:

: 00:14:32

What would I have not what I have left unfinished.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:14:36

Right? Exactly.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:14:38

Yeah, exactly. It's a very motivating question.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:14:44

When you're ready to ask it.

Wendy Green:

: 00:14:46

Yeah. And you asked it while you were still in the depths of despair?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:14:51

Yes, I was.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:14:52

But I knew.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:14:55

I knew. At the simultaneously with the with the depths was this little light

Linda Rivero:

: 00:15:05

of realization that time ends.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:15:09

It ends one day it's ends.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:15:12

It's over.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:15:14

And I think that little, little opening just got a little bit bigger and a little bit

Linda Rivero:

: 00:15:19

bigger as I focused on it more.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:15:22

And then follow through.

Wendy Green:

: 00:15:24

So. So I was thinking about this, you know, before we came on.

Wendy Green:

: 00:15:29

And and I think when you've been in a long term relationship, part of your definition of

Wendy Green:

: 00:15:34

yourself is as part of that relationship.

Wendy Green:

: 00:15:37

Right. And all of a sudden that's taken away from you.

Wendy Green:

: 00:15:40

Was this question part of how you found who you were separate from that relationship, or

Wendy Green:

: 00:15:47

are there other things that you would.

Wendy Green:

: 00:15:49

So to recommend.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:15:51

Ah, well, that's an interesting question.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:15:54

I always I loved my husband very deeply.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:15:59

At at the same time, I always felt separate.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:16:02

I never felt like I was swallowed up in the relationship.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:16:05

I just wasn't me.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:16:08

So. I never.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:16:12

I don't know. I didn't feel it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:16:13

But what did happen when he died is that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:16:17

Though he was my foundation, I always remembered that he was my anchor.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:16:22

I had no more anchor.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:16:23

Hence the dinghy in the middle of the ocean.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:16:26

So I'm not sure if I'm going.

Wendy Green:

: 00:16:31

I'm thinking, you know, like when when you are out with as a couple, you know, this is

Wendy Green:

: 00:16:37

my husband right now.

Wendy Green:

: 00:16:39

You're the wife. You're you know, you're in a partnership.

Wendy Green:

: 00:16:42

Yes. And and now you're out.

Wendy Green:

: 00:16:45

If you're even going out and you're like, who are you?

Wendy Green:

: 00:16:49

You know? Well, I'm Linda, but.

Wendy Green:

: 00:16:51

Right. I'm no longer a wife, you know, And yeah, I'm not working now because I'm so

Wendy Green:

: 00:16:59

depressed. I don't know what to be doing with myself.

Wendy Green:

: 00:17:03

So I guess that was really what I was thinking about, like, who are you?

Wendy Green:

: 00:17:06

How do you figure that out again?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:17:08

For me, the the the path to figuring it out again was what I described.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:17:15

It was the realization that I have to do whatever it is I have to do.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:17:19

I'm not even sure what it is and focusing on that and getting an answer and following

Linda Rivero:

: 00:17:23

through and that that led to more that led to 55 and Boulder that it it just opened up

Linda Rivero:

: 00:17:30

more and more as as I allowed that in.

Wendy Green:

: 00:17:34

Okay, So you have a system.

Wendy Green:

: 00:17:37

Is that the source or is that.

Wendy Green:

: 00:17:39

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Wendy Green:

: 00:17:41

Can you tell me more about that?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:17:42

Well, the Yes, sir, is.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:17:47

The fact quote the little sub the fast path to uncovering what's next after your loved

Linda Rivero:

: 00:17:54

one is gone. So it is a six week course and it's a it's the entry level course.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:01

S stands for set your intentions for major components.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:05

O obliterate your obstacles.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:07

So we talk about what's in your way because there's always stuff in your way.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:10

And the strategy for dealing with that and getting it out of your way.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:15

A Accelerate your progress using the science of your brain, meaning neuroplasticity, and

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:21

how we can actually engage our brain to make real changes and ah,

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:27

Rejoice in your results.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:29

Begin to feel the the, the feedback, you know, sort of the energy feedback and changes

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:36

in your life as you move through the process so hence soar.

Wendy Green:

: 00:18:41

I love the acronym because it really does kind of get you up into that vibrant feeling

Wendy Green:

: 00:18:45

again.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:46

Yes, exactly it does.

Wendy Green:

: 00:18:48

So is this a group workshop or is this individual.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:52

It's a group class.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:18:54

And then with a lot of interaction from me and and then goes into a more extended group

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:01

program and private private coaching.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:05

Okay.

Wendy Green:

: 00:19:06

All right. Well, super important work.

Wendy Green:

: 00:19:09

So what are some of the.

Wendy Green:

: 00:19:12

Go ahead.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:13

No, I just had a thought.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:15

Uh, I think it's important to note that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:20

Uh, that it's.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:23

We can't wait for things to be perfect to start moving.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:28

I think when we start to get those little whispers, I'm really I'm a big believer in

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:33

the importance of intuition.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:35

When we start to get a little whisper, it's so important to hear it and to pay attention

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:40

to it and move along.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:43

Not expecting grief to be gone.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:47

I don't think it's ever gone.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:49

But we learn to live with it and it certainly changes and it diminishes in in the

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:54

sense that it doesn't occupy.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:57

Our whole life anymore.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:19:59

But it has it has its place and it's sort of like a partner.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:03

You just we just kind of keep going.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:06

Um, but, but to not wait for a perfect moment.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:09

Well, okay, I'm ready now.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:10

I'm. I think I'm ready to start painting again.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:14

Well, then just pick up a paintbrush and see what happens is.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:18

Is, you know, take whatever little pieces you can get and build on those.

Wendy Green:

: 00:20:23

Yeah, because you mentioned before, when people are ready, they have to be ready to

Wendy Green:

: 00:20:29

move on. Yeah.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:31

How do you know it's not right?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:33

It's not an all or nothing thing.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:35

And again, I think yeah, it's it's so it's such a gray area and it's so individual.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:43

Yeah. So it's, it's, it is hard to define but I think that the.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:50

I dare say the universal.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:53

Peace of knowing when you're ready is when you just get those little whispers.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:20:58

You just have little sense of little is something else, and then maybe it's gone.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:04

But then it comes again.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:05

There's something else.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:06

And you start hearing it and listening and following along.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:11

Also breadcrumbs.

Wendy Green:

: 00:21:12

Like breadcrumbs. But it sounds like also finding ways to support yourself when you

Wendy Green:

: 00:21:18

hear that because we have so many fears and self doubts, right?

Wendy Green:

: 00:21:23

So how can how can friends and family and people like you support folks that are just

Wendy Green:

: 00:21:29

starting to hear that little whisper, but they're like, I don't know.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:33

Right. You know, I think with with loss, I think.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:38

It's what?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:40

What. What has.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:42

I withdrew.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:44

That's what I did.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:45

I mean, that was what I did.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:47

And I only I spoke to my children and maybe one really close friend.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:51

Um, but people are different and some people are have much stronger need for social

Linda Rivero:

: 00:21:58

engagement when they're down.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:01

And unfortunately, what I've heard many times is that they lose friends.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:06

People stop calling, people stop coming over, and it's because they don't know what

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:11

to say.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:13

People have no idea what to say and they think, Well, I'll give her time.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:16

Well, I'll leave her alone. Meanwhile, she may really need to see you.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:20

Uh, I, I for me, I think it's so important to get to.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:26

To have contact with people who understand.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:29

In my case, I had a bereavement counselor, and I was in a bereavement group, and I'm not

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:33

much of a group joiner, but I had.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:36

I had to do something and it made all the difference and enabled me to move forward,

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:41

not only because people understood, but there's a lot of a lot of understanding and

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:46

there's laughter.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:48

You know, we're all in this.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:49

And it does have its funny moments, especially when you're able to share it and

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:53

feel the trust of people who have been where you are.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:22:57

That's a whole different experience from sharing it with with a friend who may love

Linda Rivero:

: 00:23:03

you but doesn't know how to navigate it.

Wendy Green:

: 00:23:08

Yeah, because that is hard for a lot of people to know what to say.

Wendy Green:

: 00:23:11

And and I, you know, I have found and been.

Wendy Green:

: 00:23:16

Coached that sometimes you don't have to say anything just to be there.

Wendy Green:

: 00:23:21

Yeah. You know, be okay with the silence.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:23:25

Right. I agree.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:23:27

And that is also hard for some people to do.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:23:30

Yeah, they may love the idea and want to, but I feel so weird and I feel like I should

Linda Rivero:

: 00:23:35

help. And it's hard.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:23:37

Yeah. You know, we don't live in a society that that teaches us how to be silent and and

Linda Rivero:

: 00:23:43

happy with it. Yeah.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:23:45

You know, we're very. Go, go, go, go.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:23:47

Right.

Wendy Green:

: 00:23:48

I see a couple of our listeners say that when they were dealing with grief and hard

Wendy Green:

: 00:23:52

feelings, they wrote.

Wendy Green:

: 00:23:54

They wrote poems.

Wendy Green:

: 00:23:55

They wrote. Yes.

Wendy Green:

: 00:23:58

That they shared things on grief websites.

Wendy Green:

: 00:24:02

Writing can be a very healing activity.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:24:06

And that goes right into creativity.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:24:09

Mhm. I mean it's a major artery for energy and getting, getting to, getting into another

Linda Rivero:

: 00:24:16

place. Writing is super.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:24:18

Of course. It's very, very, very powerful.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:24:20

And if, if, if, if writing resonates with you, boy.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:24:25

Keep going. Just write and write and write.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:24:27

For me, it was music.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:24:29

But it comes. What is it about?

Wendy Green:

: 00:24:31

But what is it about creativity?

Wendy Green:

: 00:24:34

You know, I know when my father died, my.

Wendy Green:

: 00:24:36

My mother will always say she's not creative, but she decided to learn how to

Wendy Green:

: 00:24:40

play the ukulele.

Wendy Green:

: 00:24:42

So what is it about creativity that seems to have such a positive impact on us when we're

Wendy Green:

: 00:24:49

grieving?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:24:50

For one thing, creative activity.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:24:54

It takes us outside of ourselves.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:24:56

It we're focusing on something else and it tunes us into another piece other than the

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:03

intellectual, the rote that's going on that we're struggling with.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:08

He's lost. He's gone.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:09

He's gone. He's gone. He's gone.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:11

He's gone. You know, it removes us.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:13

If you're writing it, you know, it comes out on the page.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:18

If if I'm focusing on my on developing my voice, I'm focusing on developing my voice.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:23

And all that energy goes there.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:26

You know, if it's if it's watercolors, it's water, it's whatever it is, you know, it can

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:32

be it can be fashion design, whatever you like.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:34

But but if let's say it's fashion design for someone in that category because they know

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:40

someone for whom that that's the case And, you know, she she got to the point where she

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:45

could look online and just look for designers that she loved and look look at

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:49

stuff and take out her pad and start drawing on her colors.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:52

And it's all the same source.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:55

It's just different expressions in different people.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:25:58

But it's magical that removes us from ourselves and it also gives us a sense of

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:03

power.

Wendy Green:

: 00:26:05

Oh, tell me more about that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:07

Well, a sense of control.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:09

If a woman is writing a lot, it there's this it's energy shift that it gets out and

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:18

and it's in front of you.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:20

And then the words are there whether you read them or you don't.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:22

It's it's there.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:24

And there's a power in that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:25

And if I'm if I'm recording myself even, you know, marginally better, it's it's I know I

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:32

did it and I know I sound better than I did last time, etcetera.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:36

And it applies to any.

Wendy Green:

: 00:26:38

So what about people that are self-critical and they're like, I have no talent.

Wendy Green:

: 00:26:42

I have no, I'm not creative, you know, What do you how do you deal with them?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:50

But, you know, the first thing that comes to my mind is meditation.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:55

To get quiet because I.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:58

I don't believe that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:26:59

I think everybody has it maybe to very.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:02

Yeah. To varying degrees, perhaps.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:04

But your mother.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:06

I'm not creative but she picked up.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:08

Why are ukulele.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:09

Why didn't you know?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:11

But there you go.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:12

Case in point, I think we do all have that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:15

But if we're unable to allow that possibility, then that gets into

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:19

perfectionism and our expectations.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:23

And well, if I don't write like Byron, I can't write.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:26

You know, and it's a problem.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:29

It really it is a.

Wendy Green:

: 00:27:29

Problem, right?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:31

It stops us.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:32

And and of course, that is that's high anxiety about what we think we should be

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:39

capable of, not expression and not allowing ourselves the luxury of just opening up.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:46

And that's why I said meditation, because it, you know, it does bring down the the

Linda Rivero:

: 00:27:52

energy to a manageable, quiet, quiet level.

Wendy Green:

: 00:27:57

And you just used an important word you said should.

Wendy Green:

: 00:28:00

And I would imagine as you were coming out of this loss, a lot of people were shooting

Wendy Green:

: 00:28:06

on you. You know, you should be better by now, Linda.

Wendy Green:

: 00:28:09

You should jump. Come on, Linda, Buck yourself up.

Wendy Green:

: 00:28:13

And, uh. Yeah.

Wendy Green:

: 00:28:15

What what what are some of the shoulds that you heard and how do you deal with those?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:28:20

Uh, my mother was remarkable, and she was a great mom in many ways.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:28:26

However, this kind of understanding was not her strong suit.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:28:31

And maybe a couple of years after, after my husband died, we were talking about that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:28:39

And she said.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:28:43

Boy, you really you were really down there.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:28:45

And I said, Well, yeah.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:28:49

And I said, Well, it was a very deep loss.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:28:52

You said, Yeah, but you went overboard.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:28:54

I mean that's really. Yeah, I know you don't say that, but she did.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:28:58

I mean, this is the one thing about my mother and it's negative, but she.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:03

She had a lot of your mother.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:04

We love. Yeah, I love my mother, too.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:06

And she's gone. But I miss her and I love her.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:09

But that just.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:11

Well, that hurt because it was my mother.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:13

But I just tried to change the channel and just, you know, call a good friend who

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:23

wasn't going to say something like that and kind of counterbalance it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:28

Yeah. And people, you know, if people are nobody was ever intrusive with me about that

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:33

because I don't I don't because they weren't I don't really allow that kind of thing.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:39

But it that can certainly happen if you have friends that you love.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:43

But sometimes they kind of overstep and if possible to to just have the wherewithal to

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:49

say back off.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:29:51

Just back off.

Wendy Green:

: 00:29:53

Yeah. And I think we do it to ourselves.

Wendy Green:

: 00:29:56

You know, we might look out a year or two and say, I should be over this by now, you

Wendy Green:

: 00:30:02

know? But like you said, you never.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:04

Totally you never you're never totally over it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:08

Someone was referring to to it yesterday as, as I'm I want to be done with grief.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:14

And my response to that is, well, look, good luck with that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:18

But you never get really done with it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:20

But it does morph, It changes.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:22

And, uh, here's a very interesting case in point that completely astonished me.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:29

My husband died ten years ago, and we his sons and my son, the three boys and I went

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:38

down to the Outer Banks in North Carolina to do this little ritual that he requested when

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:44

he died. So we did that, and that was ten years ago.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:48

And this year was the 10th anniversary.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:50

And I gathered the boys and I said, I'd like to repeat that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:54

And they said, okay.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:55

So we went down and repeated.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:30:58

I mean, it was a happy thing, but we repeated it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:01

And to my complete astonishment, it was closure for me.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:05

I couldn't believe it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:06

I thought I was there.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:08

I thought I was done.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:09

But but apparently not.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:11

And it was doing that that made me realize he's really gone.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:16

I mean, he's seriously not coming back.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:19

And it it was so surprising.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:22

It was so surprising that that was still in there to be to be resolved after all that.

Wendy Green:

: 00:31:27

Time.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:28

After all that time and all that activity.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:30

Yeah. I mean, I do stuff, you know.

Wendy Green:

: 00:31:32

Right. You do stuff and you work with people and.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:35

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:37

And it was surprising and it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:39

It feels good, but it doesn't mean I forgot him.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:43

I think about him every day, you know?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:45

Right. Right. And I'm sorry.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:46

He's. I mean, I wish he were here.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:48

There's still times, and I guess enough already.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:50

Where are you? Enough of this game.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:53

But it's. It's.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:54

It's done. It's over.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:31:55

And it happens in life.

Wendy Green:

: 00:31:58

It does. It does.

Wendy Green:

: 00:32:00

I've had a few comments here about loss in the family of siblings, children.

Wendy Green:

: 00:32:09

Those are not the kinds of clients that you work with.

Wendy Green:

: 00:32:13

Is that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:32:14

Right? No, I really work primarily with people who have lost a partner.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:32:19

Um. And I think that and we've said this in our own conversations, but there are

Linda Rivero:

: 00:32:27

certainly similarities in loss.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:32:29

But I think there are also differences in dealing with the loss of the loss of God

Linda Rivero:

: 00:32:35

knows what the loss of a child, which I truly cannot I can't I don't feel equipped to

Linda Rivero:

: 00:32:42

address that. I have no experience in that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:32:45

And if someone were to come with me and and present that, I would I would help that

Linda Rivero:

: 00:32:53

person find the, you know, the right, the right support system.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:32:58

It's not so.

Wendy Green:

: 00:32:58

And I appreciate that about you, Linda.

Wendy Green:

: 00:33:00

So, I mean, you have you have a background, you are trained therapist, counselor and a

Wendy Green:

: 00:33:06

trained coach.

Wendy Green:

: 00:33:07

And and you're bringing yourself your whole self to this, having lived it and experienced

Wendy Green:

: 00:33:14

it. And I think that makes you an even more empathetic guide for the clients that you

Wendy Green:

: 00:33:22

get.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:33:23

Yeah, Thank you.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:33:24

I do feel strongly about that.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:33:26

And the more I do it, the more strongly I feel about how important it is that to have

Linda Rivero:

: 00:33:32

my story.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:33:34

Because I really can hear someone else's story.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:33:38

Yeah. And and work with that understanding.

Wendy Green:

: 00:33:43

And connect with them on that level and connect that way.

Wendy Green:

: 00:33:46

Yeah. Yeah.

Wendy Green:

: 00:33:48

So soar is the entry level.

Wendy Green:

: 00:33:51

What goes beyond that?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:33:53

Well, we go from from a six week to a six month.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:33:58

And it's the same material.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:01

But of course, we go deeper.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:03

You know, it's like it's like the proverbial onion.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:06

We can do the first layer, but it's not going to erase everything that's underneath.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:14

And so then we go back, but we go deeper and it's more talk.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:18

It's different exercises.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:20

Yeah, yeah.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:22

A deeper dive.

Wendy Green:

: 00:34:23

And, you know, I was just thinking about the ritual that you and your sons all experienced

Wendy Green:

: 00:34:30

once when he died.

Wendy Green:

: 00:34:32

And now, ten years later.

Wendy Green:

: 00:34:34

Do you talk about rituals with your clients?

Wendy Green:

: 00:34:37

Finding a ritual for saying goodbye?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:40

Yes. I mean, some people connect with that, some don't.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:45

You know, it doesn't resonate and that's fine.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:48

But, you know, rituals have been around since forever, since human life.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:54

And there's a reason, you know, they they ground us.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:34:58

They ground us, and they place us in time and in our lives.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:35:04

You know, a wedding is a ritual, you know, a confirmation, a baptism, a briss, whatever it

Linda Rivero:

: 00:35:11

is. There are reasons.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:35:13

And I think that creating our own family rituals and particularly around death and

Linda Rivero:

: 00:35:18

some some cultures have those built in and others really don't.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:35:24

So. If you create your own, that's good.

Wendy Green:

: 00:35:29

Yeah, because I think it can be really helpful.

Wendy Green:

: 00:35:31

I'm not a death expert either, but, you know, I feel like it it.

Wendy Green:

: 00:35:39

It makes it more easy to talk about, right?

Wendy Green:

: 00:35:42

As you said, people don't know what to say.

Wendy Green:

: 00:35:44

They don't know how to address you.

Wendy Green:

: 00:35:46

You don't know how to talk to them about it.

Wendy Green:

: 00:35:49

If you form some kind of ritual, some clothes, like a funeral is a ritual, too.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:35:55

Right. Right.

Wendy Green:

: 00:35:57

But some way to say goodbye and to get closure.

Wendy Green:

: 00:35:59

I think it makes it.

Wendy Green:

: 00:36:01

It normalizes it a little bit.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:03

Yes. Yes.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:05

The the funeral, of course, is a ritual.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:08

The thing with the funerals is that it's so soon after the loss.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:13

Right. It's it's coming back a month later, three months later, six months later.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:19

And but you can do that in, you know, in with your with your children or if if that's

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:24

the kind of relationship ship that you have or with your whoever is close to you, you

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:30

know, with your closest friend, with your sister, with your however that works in

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:35

someone's life. But yeah, I agree.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:37

I think it is important.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:38

And and I realized it was more important than I even realized this this time when we

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:44

redid this ritual after ten years and I realized the impact it had on me.

Wendy Green:

: 00:36:51

Yeah. Well, something else you can add to your class.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:36:55

Right, right.

Wendy Green:

: 00:36:57

Right. I'll ask you someone, any of the listeners that might be dealing with a loss

Wendy Green:

: 00:37:04

like this or know there's one coming up.

Wendy Green:

: 00:37:06

Are there are there a couple of takeaways that you can leave with people to help them

Wendy Green:

: 00:37:11

start to move on from a loss?

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:16

The we.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:19

The first again, the first thing that comes to my mind is something we hear all the time.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:24

So it's overused, it's hackneyed.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:27

We hear it, but it's true.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:31

Which is taking care of yourself.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:34

Which is really hard to do.

Wendy Green:

: 00:37:36

Really hard to do. When you feel so down, you feel awful.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:40

Or if you're around the clock care taker, which I experienced and I'm actually

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:46

experiencing it again with with someone else.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:48

Not a partner though, a very close friend.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:51

Um, it's, it's exhausting.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:54

And it, it saps, it saps everything.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:37:58

It, it not only saps our energy, like we aren't sleeping enough or we're not sleeping

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:02

well, but it saps our focus on, just on, on, on just getting quiet.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:09

I'm getting centered.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:10

So, you know, it's the same.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:15

I feel apologetic saying self care because it's so canned, but it's canned for a reason.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:21

It it it works and it and it's it's necessary.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:26

I don't think you can move on without starting to listen to yourself.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:30

And how can you start to hear that little whisper that I was talking about earlier if

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:35

you never get quiet.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:38

And how can you get quiet if you never sleep or you never take a moment for yourself or

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:42

you never take a hot bath or whatever works for you or meditate.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:46

And maybe it's possible.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:47

Maybe it's not. Maybe you're too agitated to meditate, but whatever it is, taking a walk.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:53

In anything by the water, by the flowers, whatever it is.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:38:58

But you need to know what it is and do it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:01

And it can be really hard.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:02

Sometimes you just really don't want to.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:04

I don't want to take the stupid bath.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:05

I don't want to run the I don't want to do it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:08

But. It might be better if you did, you know.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:12

Yeah.

Wendy Green:

: 00:39:13

Yeah. So self care and and then start.

Wendy Green:

: 00:39:17

I think the other thing is to start to trust that little voice that's talking about

Wendy Green:

: 00:39:21

creative. Try it.

Wendy Green:

: 00:39:23

Try it.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:24

Right, right, right.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:26

That little voice, that saying anything, I mean, you know.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:29

Well, call that person or.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:32

Go to that. Try that group.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:34

Connect with those people.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:35

You know, it's always little intuition doesn't hit us over the head.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:40

Yeah, it will.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:41

It'll be there if we're if we're attuned to the existence of it and we believe in it and

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:47

we rely on it because it's us.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:49

It's what's in us.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:51

Right. It's.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:39:52

Yeah.

Wendy Green:

: 00:39:54

Well, I appreciate.

Wendy Green:

: 00:39:56

What you shared with us today and what you are sharing with others.

Wendy Green:

: 00:40:01

So let me show people how they can reach out to you.

Wendy Green:

: 00:40:06

You know, people we never know when we're dealing going to have to deal with.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:40:10

Something like this. Right.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:40:11

Thank you. Thank you.

Wendy Green:

: 00:40:13

Yeah. So you can email Linda at Rivero, Rivero Linda at gmail.com

Wendy Green:

: 00:40:23

and you can check out her website which is the number 55 and Boulder Co not comm but

Wendy Green:

: 00:40:32

CO and you'll find all kinds of resources there and articles.

Wendy Green:

: 00:40:39

You know what Linda's all about.

Wendy Green:

: 00:40:40

You'll get more ideas about Linda at 55 and Boulder CO.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:40:47

Yes thank you Wendy and also have a little.

Wendy Green:

: 00:40:51

You have your. Giveaway.

Wendy Green:

: 00:40:52

Yes. Tell us about the giveaway.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:40:55

It's really hard to anyway, rather than do this chaotic on screen thing, it's seven

Linda Rivero:

: 00:41:01

Soothing secrets to Happiness for the mature Woman in Transition and their seven Soothing

Linda Rivero:

: 00:41:09

secrets. Ways to start moving forward as as you were just asking me that that are

Linda Rivero:

: 00:41:17

comforting, that feel good and are doable to start going forward and at 55 in boulder.co

Linda Rivero:

: 00:41:24

they'll there's a little spot you know they'll be able to put in their name there

Linda Rivero:

: 00:41:28

and I'll be happy to share that I think it's I think it's good I think it's worthwhile.

Wendy Green:

: 00:41:34

Right. Well I appreciate that.

Wendy Green:

: 00:41:36

Linda. Thank you.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:41:37

Thank you. Thank you.

Linda Rivero:

: 00:41:38

Wendy. Yeah.

Wendy Green:

: 00:41:39

So before I let you all go, I want you to remember, please to share this episode with

Wendy Green:

: 00:41:47

your friends and family.

Wendy Green:

: 00:41:48

It really does help to grow the show the more that you share it and if you like the

Wendy Green:

: 00:41:54

content of what we're doing, you can support the work by going to the website, buy me a

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:00

coffee.com and then you would say slash hey Boomer 0413 and you can support any amount

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:09

that you feel good about.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:10

I would greatly appreciate that.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:13

And also make sure that you check out Road Scholar.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:18

Just just go and have fun and look at their site.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:22

Road Road Scholar.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:24

Org slash.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:26

Hey Boomer. And it's important that you add the slash hey Boomer so that they know that

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:31

you heard about them from the hey boomer show.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:36

And next week.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:38

Next week we take another turn.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:41

And my guest is a woman named Julie Noonan.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:45

And Julie has been an organizational change leader.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:49

And just about the time the pandemic shut us down, she decided to go out on her own as a

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:54

consultant and she became a certified executive coach.

Wendy Green:

: 00:42:59

And she primarily works with owners of small businesses.

Wendy Green:

: 00:43:03

So Julie and I are going to talk about some of the emotional fallout that companies feel

Wendy Green:

: 00:43:09

or that individuals feel when they are separating from the small business that they

Wendy Green:

: 00:43:15

grew and nurtured for many, many years.

Wendy Green:

: 00:43:18

So join us for that.

Wendy Green:

: 00:43:20

That should be interesting.

Wendy Green:

: 00:43:22

And I'd like to leave you all with the belief that we can all live with curiosity,

Wendy Green:

: 00:43:29

live with relevance, and live with courage.

Wendy Green:

: 00:43:32

And remember that you are never too old to set another goal or dream a new dream.

Wendy Green:

: 00:43:38

My name is Wendy Green and this has been.